Shoulder Injuries

[Parkntwoputt]

So, what is the likelihood of returning to full form after possibly slightly tearing your rotator cuff in your throwing arm? I have opted to take off from playing until spring. For me to actually bring my arm across my chest in the back hand throwing motion brings extreme pain.

I don't even care about being able to compete in the Open Division ever again, I just want to make sure I can play for the enjoyment of it.

Anyone with any expertise in this matter? I would value your input, thanks. It has been one month since I injured my shoulder. At first, for the first few days I could barely even move the arm. Now I have full range of motion back.

["Tiger"]

I can tell you that assuming you go through rehab well and the tear isn't too severe and hasn't disrupted any nerves you should be able to at least throw again.

[Hilltopper]

Well, lets start at the beginning...

1. How severe is the tear? If it doesn't require surgery, you might be able to rehab it back almost to normal. Tom Monroe had a minor tear several years ago and rehabed fine with minimal loss of distance. If you have surgery see below.

2. What type of surgery is required? Lets say you just have an impingement syndrome. In that case you would be back to normal in a few months. You could throw within a month of the surgery. If you have a full blown tear with a surgical repair, then you're looking at 6 months without golf at least. 1 month will probably spent with your arm in a sling completely immobile except for the occasional shower, exercise session, and incredibly painful stretching at PT. You should be able to return to golf though with minimal loss of distance after about 6 months. In the worst case, you could have a labral tear. In that case, who knows? Some people recover very well, some don't. You would be able to lift your arm and use it for small stuff, maybe even throw without pain, but you would definitely have a loss of length and accuracy in that case. 6 month recovery time minimum.

My best advice: if its a tear, rest won't fix it. You can try PT, but if it is torn badly enough, go ahead and get the surgery. 6 months and you will be as good as new. In the mean time, play lefty. Baseball pitchers have RC tears all the time and come back with mostly positive results. Not Labral repairs though, ask Chad Pennington.

Josh

[Parkntwoputt]

I do not think that it is bad. It only hurts when pulling across my chest (holding it up in that angle primarily), and when raising my hand up in a "statue of liberty" pose.

Plus I landed on my shoulder and not where I yanked my arm at an akward angle. My arm was tucked in on my side when I hit square on my shoulder at 20+ mph. At first I was thinking that I may have just brusied cartiledge or inflammed the bursa, but considering now I still have issues with select motions, talking with other people with shoulder injuries, it is likely that I may have a slight tear of the rotator cuff.

Josh, how long would you suggest I wait until I start PT? It has been a month since I landed on my shoulder.

[Justin L]

Gotta love the DGB website, post up a request for medical advice and you get a md in training and a physical therapist within twenty minutes....how is that for service? :)

[Rob H]

I thought this thread was going to be about Matt Flynn... His shoulder seems to be doing well GEAUX TIGERS

[drdisc]

Use all that good health insurance from Coors. Get it fixed and after 2-3 months of rehab, you will be ready to go. During the rehab they will probably put you on weights etc., and you might come back stronger than ever. 500' next summer? It could happen.

[bobsatter]

well speaking for someone who has had both shoulders fixed and getting the left one done again in a few weeks, you will be throwing again in no time. The only draw back that i have is a slight hitch at the end of my thrwoing. It feels like my right shoulder or arm is a little shorter when pulling thru on drives. A good stretch is required before every round to not feel like I am short arming my drives. The surgery is not to bad and the only thing to keep in mind is continue with the rehab even when you feel ok. I have opted out early both times and this maybe why I have the hitch.

I would also suggest the shot of cortizone, it burns going in but, relief in minutes after the injection. I was unable to lift my left arm after getting slammed by a wave my second day here. The shot had me feeling like there was no damage but the MRI said otherwise.

One last thing find A GOOD ORTHO and you will be throwing in no time. As for healing on its own..... The Dr said that is not happening so under the knife for the third time ;[

[Thomas M]

Man we are getting old. I just moved to little rock and ended up with a bulging disc or nerve pinch in my neck that has me all screwed up. I did play one round here on 4 loratabs but I dont think that is a good long term solution. Got a prescription for a month of physical therapy about 2 hours ago. Oh well, I wasn t supposed to have time to play out here anyway. Good luck Chris, Bob, and all you other old timers.
By the way 50 mph winds seem to be normal here right now. DOH!

T

[Hilltopper]

Kris,
The standard easy test for a possible RC tear is what is called an "empty can" test. Here's a pic of the test: http://www.indexedvisuals.com/scripts/ivstock/pic.asp?id=119-054

You only do the arm that is injured. If it hurts, then you have some kind of RC injury. If you are unable to lift your hand into the position without helping it or if it gives with very little resistance, you have a full blown tear.

Just an FYI, just because your shoulder hurts in similar movements to other people who have had an injury, it doesn't mean you have a tear as opposed to an impingement. They both hurt in similar locations with similar movements. Both will hurt on the front of the shoulder at one of the biceps origins, under where the clavicle and scapula meet, and throughout the deltoid muscle (usually at the attatchment). Another thing you might want to look at is whether or not it is really a neck problem. Neck injuries hurt in the trapezius, which is often confused with being a shoulder problem. People think shoulder pain hurts on the back. Usually it hurts on the front of your body.

As for PT, you can start it at any time. Go to a doc first. He'll probably inject it and give you antiinflammatories which may fix it.

Josh

A quick word of warning: if you do have surgery, ask your ortho whether or not he has any residents. If he does, ask him who will be doing the surgery. Often it won't be him, but a baby doc in training. They don't tell you because they know you'ld balk at having a first year resident do his first RC repair on your arm.

["Tiger"]

A quick word of warning: if you do have surgery, ask your ortho whether or not he has any residents. If he does, ask him who will be doing the surgery. Often it won't be him, but a baby doc in training. They don't tell you because they know you'ld balk at having a first year resident do his first RC repair on your arm.


Very true. We have to learn somehow ;)

[Parkntwoputt]

I am really dreading that there is something legitmately injured with me again. I am sick of being hurt. I have been perpetually injured since September of 2006!

I really didn't understand that diagram Josh, but today during my lunch break I was looking in the refridgerator, and out of habit had my hand on the top of the door. When I leaned in to look closer, I had some extreme pain that caused me to yell obsenities, scaring this old man who was enjoying his sandwich in the cafeteria. Is that a clue to anything? If I have resistance to lifting my arm up, it causes slight pain, maybe a 3 on a scale of 10. But the refridgerator incident caused something more like an 9.

I gotta buy a new car in the next few weeks and just cannot afford any more doctors bills. That is why I am wishing for a miracle and just have my shoulder miraculously get better.

[drdisc]

Buy a used car, use that Coors insurance, get fixed.

["Tiger"]

what exactly did you do to it? was it from throwing? did you run into/fall into something?

[Parkntwoputt]

what exactly did you do to it? was it from throwing? did you run into/fall into something?

It was a lesson for riding in powder.

Early AM on the mountain there was 6 inches of fresh powder. I was mainly riding on the groomed runs, but the edges were not groomed. I was riding toe side (face facing the mountain) and I went to turn heel side (facing down hill). When I initiatied my turn I did not realize that I rode into fresh powder. At the apex of my turn I had too much weight on my lead foot and I dug the nose of my board into the snow. I was flipped forward at about 20mph. I landed directly on my right shoulder.

I had my elbows tucked into my sides, my arm was not yanked or ripped in an odd direction. All my weight at that speed landed on my deltoid muscle in the snow. Under the 6 inches of fresh powder was 35 inches of packed powder, which basically is pretty hard after those snow cats get done with them.

At least now I have learned to ride in powder! :eek:

[Hilltopper]

Did your shoulder feel like it was going to jump out of place when you did that today? That is a sign of shoulder instability. Just pain doesn't mean anything. End range external rotation generally is a painful position with any shoulder injury. Here's the standard shoulder instability test:
http://orthoassessment.blogspot.com/2007/01/shoulder-apprehension-test.html

It has video. You can do it yourself without someone pushing on your arm. Just lie on your back and do rotate your shoulder back. If you feel like its going to "pop" out. The problem in instability, which means you could be subluxing.

Josh

PS Diagnosing over the internet is spotty at best.

[Thomas M]

Chris, where are you exactly? I have a buddy in Carbondale who is a big boarder who like sto climb up to the "fresh" powder.

[Parkntwoputt]

Chris, where are you exactly? I have a buddy in Carbondale who is a big boarder who like sto climb up to the "fresh" powder.

Thomas, I am living in Lakewood, CO. It is a southwest suburb of Denver. About 3 hours from your buddy in Carbondale. The resorts I go to, "the big Vail owned" resorts are about an hour west of me. Plus I am barely on the Blue-Intermediate slopes as is. The "fresh" powder that you hike to is usually either black or double diamond. It may take me a few years to reach that level.

Yeah Josh, no feeling of dislocation. Just pain. But I suppose hitting what feels like concrete at 20mph might cause some long term pain. I was told that due to a reduced level of blood flow, shoulders take longer to heal the other areas of the body. Is that true?

Tom, I am looking to buy a '02-'05 Explorer. Yeah I need a 4-wheel drive SUV for the lifestyle that I am living now. Too much camping, tubing and snowboarding in the moutains for a car or little truck.

[drdisc]

Hey Josh, I "jammed" my shoulder once when I fell down and landed on my hand. The PT people called it "frozen shoulder". Could Kris have that?
Kris, those 2 door Explorer/Blazers are pretty cool. Maybe hard to find.

[Parkntwoputt]

Woke up this morning and while getting ready I noticed something "odd" about my shoulder.

There is a baseball sized green bruise starting to come out, right about the main area of pain (lower delt). It looks really wicked blending in with one of my tattoos.

Yeah Tom, looking at a 4-dr explorer. Snowboarders are cheap mooches, and will bum rides with anyone they can. You will typically see 4 boarders climbing out of a mid sized car with all their gear. Tight fit, and I don't want to have to deal with that.

[bobsatter]

The resorts I go to, "the big Vail owned" resorts are about an hour west of me!

You must have wings to get to vail in one hour. Or did vail buy up loveland , keystone, breck, copper mtn???? Man I miss the mountains in the winter. Did you buy your equipment yet? I have a full setup that I would sell cheap. Burton Board& boots. I can email you the pics.

Maybe that bruise is a good thing as the three times I have messed mine up I had no bruising.

[Parkntwoputt]

Yeah, Vail bought Keystone, Breck, Beaver Creek, and Heavenly. Yeah Vail is a trek. Takes about 90 mins in good weather, which this time of year does not exist past Georgetown on the Divide.

I usually ride Keystone, Breck and A-Basin. There is a new terrain park called Echo Mtn, that is only 30 minutes from Denver. It's fun but small.

Is that a freestyle board? I am looking for another board for next season, preferrably one that is pretty flexible to handle jumps. My board is a great powder/all mountain. And yeah, I bought my gear. There are insane sales around here during pre-season.

Send pics and specs, and sizes. allenkr03@hotmail.com. Your about the same size as me so I imagine that your setup would fit me. I am riding a 166 wide right now, but am going to go shorter for a freestyle board.



Since this bruise is starting to come out, my arm is feeling better. But still sore.

[Glen Iris Southpaw]

Kris next time you do that remember what my hydrotherapy teacher told me, the hot and cold uses of water are perhaps the oldest medicine known to humankind but I always forget is it cold then hot or hot then cold glad to here it wasnt a tear but perhaps just a bad strain and bruise.

[Parkntwoputt]

I can do the backhand throwing motion pain free!

I am pretty stiff from the lack of movement I have been giving my arm for the last 7 weeks, but it has seemed to help. If I can get fluid movement back in my arm I might try playing DG this weekend. It is supposed to be in the 40's and there is a pitch and putt course about 2 blocks from my apartment. But I will be smart, if I am not feeling at least 90% I am not even going to try.

But at least I am pain free now! Woo Hoo!:D

[Parkntwoputt]

Well I managed to get in 18 holes this weekend. The course by my house is a 9 hole "pitch-n-putt" course and is pretty much wide open with the longest hole being 296ft. I was only throwing at about 75% of power and was able to break the 300ft threshold with a midrange still, which is a good long term sign that I will get back to 100% power and distance.

Yeah, so after basically taking a year and a half off from disc golf, my putting has gone to royal crud. I think for both rounds of 9 I was only 3 down on each round.

But it felt good to play again. A little sore from being out of shape, but it was worth it. And I couldn't pass up 63 degree temps.

[drdisc]

63 ? That was warmer then here all weekend. Break out those practice putters.